28 December, 2008

"Dubai residents protest against air strikes"

Dubai: More than 500 residents demonstrated at the Palestinian consulate in Dubai against Israeli air strikes in Gaza Strip. Hundreds of Gazans were killed in the air strikes. The offensive began eight days after a six-month truce between Israel and the militants expired.


In the meantime an Israeli woman describes what's happening in Gaza as 'fantastic':

"Finally, a month and a half before the elections, Israel takes some action. I definitely see this as linked, but it's OK, better late than never. What's been happening in Gaza is fantastic. I feel very bad about the man killed in [the Israeli town of] Netivot. "

95 comments:

Anonymous said...

Palestinian consulate? How can a consulate exist for an entity that isnt a country?!

Only in the Arab world.

So again, as always, the various factions that make up the Palestinian fiasco cant back one single leader, you have crazy yahoos doing what they want in Gaza, as the actual president (and I use the term lightly) Abbas is against what they are doing... but has no control over them...

I dont see why this is such a huge issue. You have a "group" not a government, and not a country, attacking a country. like it or not, Israel IS a country, and has been for 50 some odd years.

And when that country attacked back, its bad?

The west bacnk should attack Gaza, take it over, cleanse it of crazy people, and the give up the dream of having Jerusalem for the next 100 or so years.

The west bank can be Palestine. simple. Maybe one day Israel wont exist, that land has been MANY MANY countries over the last 2000 years.

For now, wouldnt having a real country, under one government, be better than whats going on?

And Im sick and tired of hearing about this. Palestinians arent any more special the Iraqis, or or people in Zimbabwe. The world has a thousand and one issues, Im tired of reading, seeing, and being asked to donate to their case.

In fact, I now want to donate to the Israeli army. No, Im not kidding.

Also, this (the UAE) isnt a democracy (Thank God), the right to assemble is not a part of our constitution. Those 500 "demonstrators" should have been arrested and sent back to gaza.

Anonymous said...

لتبطل حربك يا اسرائيل
و اين هي المنظمات العالمية

ربنا اغفرلنا

Arab Lady said...

Any proper channel of collecting donation?
Plz advise

UAEYIAN GIRL said...

Anonymous, Why are you scared to comment with your REAL nickname? I cannot believe that you are supporting such aggression! I doubt you are human yourself, just like the zionists bombing the innocent civilians in Gaza, you are no better!
You are a terrorist for supporting such terrorist acts! ! !
We Muslims, Arabs, have the right to protest whether you like it or not! That is the least we could do. Even if the UAE doesn't suppport protests, the police stood by this one! ;)


Please don't act you are from the UAE or live here, zionists like yourself are banned from entering the UAE. Eat your heart and crap out ;)

Best brother ever said...

يا رب انصر المجاهدين

Anonymous said...

^^ correct!

I want to donate as well. ...to the Israeli army.

Anonymous said...

Why Israel attacked Gaza?? Read on..
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1868829,00.html

Anonymous said...

Anon:
much of what you say may be true but it doesn't alter the fact that if you have friends or family in any place undergoing something like this your heart bleeds every time you turn on the TV or try to make a phone call.

Proud Emirati said...

Go Hamas Go

DUBAI JAZZ said...

Israel existence = the right to massacre.

DUBAI JAZZ said...

Arab Lady,

The red cross, the red crescent and WFP come to mind. But I have absolutely no idea who's operating on the grounds now.

And as far as I know, access for humanitarian supplies is still not granted (yet).

Cheeky Minx or Let's call a spade a spade! said...

@ Anon, I second UAEYian Girl, don't hide behind anonymity to have a shot at vitriol, be a man about it, show your face. If you can.

Oh and yes, don't say "(...)is not a part of OUR constitution". Nobody's buying that you are a local, quit trying.

@ DJ, what's WFP?

Do we know if the $$ collected will go towards providing immediate assistance to victims?? Don't wish to contribute to organisations that take forever to release funds to victims. Appreciate a feedback.

DUBAI JAZZ said...

@ Cheeky Minx,

World Food Program. It's a UN organization so I'd believe they're under thorough audits and scruitny. I am not sure you can specifically donate to Gaza, you probably have to donate to their main website (i.e. their main pool of donation that will serve on all fronts).
Check our their link.

Dana said...

Oy gevalt :(

I wish we could all just live in peace.

Applies to both the war and the "debates" here.

Anonymous said...

اين هي المنظمات العربية

where are the shaijs, emirs, kings
where are the solidarity between brothers
what are they doing? going to banquets and celebrating the new year
ربنا اغفرلنا

Arabietta said...

Anons: Are you fucking serious? Wow. Thems fightin' words.

Anonymous said...

اين هي المنظمات العربية
يا ربّنا اغفرلنا

where are the sheijs, emirs , kings
what are they doing while brothers and sisters are suffering a masacre
why not all together using their power and money against this agression
poor Ummah
poor Islam
God forgive us, lead the jijhadist to Firdaus

Hate Amerrrrika.... no wait... i can get a green card.. WOW... lovveee amerika.. land of freedom.. said...

aaah i can almost see it coming now. the looonnnng list of products to economically boycott. the calls to condemn america for its support of israel yadayadayadayada.... the cycle continues :)

when will ppl realise this is DO-BUY! we luv our brands. we cant live without em. yea we get all worked up seeing bloodied kids in the papers... but hey wat the heck... we can discuss it over a cuppa starbucks or take it all down with sm coke.

dear gazans, ur on ur own.... i mite send a couple a hundred dirhams over to u in charity coz a long time ago smone told me abt this concept of 'muslim brotherhood' but beyond that.. BLAAAH!!

now ppl... who is attending shakira in abu dhabi!!!????

Lirun said...

thats a very biassed post.. im not surprised though..

as an israeli alli can say is that i am very sad about the death and destruction.. people are living in great fear on both sides..

this is not human..

im not sure what hammas was expecting in sending us rockets all the time..

its not the road to peace.. as the BBC said last night - israel has never been a pussy cat about defending itself..

in israel there is a lot of debate about the situation and there have been protests either way..

http://emspeace.blogspot.com/2008/12/not-show.html

as one anonymous writer wrote - we have been around for 60 years as a country and dont plan on disappearing..

peace is preferable..

i think the residents of gaza are worthy of your tribute.. so are their families and their friends.. a lot of people are extremely pained by whats going on..

i guess this is relevant to the UAE because palestinian refugees fled to your region after 67 if i understand correctly..

i guess the discussion of the mumbai attack established this relevance..

i think your responses are interesting..

Zafar said...

We need to unite as Muslims and Arabs and respond in the same language that they understand.

Protests will not stop them from doing what they are doing, we have to unleash the similar response in Israel in specific and other supporting countries in general to make them understand the pain such an incident causes.

If required more 9/11s are required.

biscuitinabasket said...

I think 2 things need to be addressed here-
1) In desperation i.e. when you have hardly any food or medicine or any basic ammeneties, people will react differently. If this situation would take place in a first world country for example - i.e. food and medicine was "not available" for long long periods..... I ask you - how would the ordinary people react?

2) Israel will not recognise Hamas, and Hamas will not recognise Israel. I think we can all agree that we are not going anywhere on that front. Surely - the 2 sides have to reach a compromise of some sorts in order to reduce and remove the suffering away from ordinary citizens.

Finally - I think this point nails the issue. In this year alone, circa 250 people have died in Gaza because they could not get a permit to leave the boundaries of Gaza to get treatment in places where the required facilities were available. These were high profiled people i.e. old people and children. I ask you - what if this was your mother, father or child? What if this was you - you had a critical illness which required treatment? What if you were in such a disputed region? Would you put your regional territory ahead of your health? I think not. Common sense would say that you would think about your health - Israel is not letting these people basic (HUMAN!) rights to healthcare.

The Palestinian rocket fire should stop, but peace works 2 ways, don't you think?

Cheeky Minx or Let's call a spade a spade! said...

@ Lirun,
"i guess this is relevant to the UAE because palestinian refugees fled to your region after 67 if i understand correctly.. i guess the discussion of the mumbai attack established this relevance.."

Erm.. how about it is relevant to the UAE community here because a demonstration took place in DUBAI which is in the UAE last I heard...

Poor attempt at irony mate, try again!

DUBAI JAZZ said...

This comment probably says it best:

Jesse Owen said:
Yes, if you invade someone’s home and chain them up in their backyard you have the perfect right to beat them near death when they try and fight back.
The police come and you defend your action: “Look! He always scratches me when I come to the back yard. Yesterday I loosened his chains a bit and he kicked me! So I think I have the right to beat him.”
And the police admonish the chained man: “If you didn’t always try and fight, he wouldn’t beat you! it’s what you deserve!”
I guess no one sees the chains anymore and has forgotten about the home invasion… that is everyone except the chained man

http://globalvoicesonline.org/2008/12/27/arab-world-reacts-to-gaza-massacre/#comment-1542136

Emaratiya said...

Every muslim country should Send 100,000 soldiers immediately to Gaza to protect their Muslim brothers/sisters being slaughtered there, depose Mahmood abbas and enter palestine from 5 directions, Iranians will enter through Syria, let it cook for one month and see what happens, throw arms on the palestinians by Air, shut down the Oil wells for 60 days, lets grab a popcorn and watch the fun!

Lirun said...

cheeky minx

it wasnt an attempt at irony..

i simply recall the recent heated debate about the mumbai issue being relevant..

protests about gaza have happened all around the world..

i think a demographic nexus is more relevant..

not sure why you need to hunt for irony.. if you have any questions about my opinion "mate" you can go ahead and ask and ill answer..

hoping this violence ends soon..

enough is enough

bekafi
maspik

Lirun said...

biscuit - today we had a terror attack.. a palestinian guy stabbed 4 jews outside a synagogue..

the terrorist was demobilised by secuity personnel and is now being treated in israeli hospitals.. with our tax money.. this happens all the time.. we constantly medically treat those who attack us.. but how far do you go..

where does this end?

kahlil gibran said...

emaratiyah,

what the devil kind of comment is that? are you trying to be funny or simply frustrated at your own impotence & incompetence in not being able to find a solution to this adventurous mayhem by your so-called brethren?

i get it. you want everybody to do as you say while you laze on your barca lounger with a pina colada and a bucket of popcorn to entertain yourself.

if you have something left in your head that is if you have one to begin with, use it in a wise manner instead of talking out of your @$$.

Emaratiya said...

Israel always was a rogue State a nation that trained assassins. They have turned disinformation into a fine art. Just substitute the words they use for Hamas attacks by what they use to paint white their slaughter of civilian populations and the news articles will sound just about right. Let us not forget the Hamas is the elected voice of the people and if they want to resist illegal occupation of their land it is our bounden duty to support them. The Israeli and the western thugs supporting them should be dealt with any which way one can.......As for the Palestinians who are resisting this, let me assure them that as a believer in Allah and I am sure this God is just and would never let down those oppressed because He has given them the right to resist and expect them to do so. This is the right hand to us by the creator since the birth of Adam and will continue until peace will return to the whole of this planet.

Arab Lady said...

If Palestinians had weapons or proper army, occupying Zionists would vanish & go to hell with their promised holy land dream….they would have been kicked out not only from Gaza but also West Bank & 48 territories exactly as Hizb Allah have done….

Nasser Allah taught them a tough lesson & wish if Palestinians could do the same…committing war crimes via attacking innocent civilians by air force is so disgusting & shameful …..

Despite all the hell Palestinians go through they still have faith & wont give up …

Peace talks will lead to nothing …they have been doing so for the past 4 decades wut the hell did they achieve ???

Anonymous said...

امين

God bless and make the palestinian jijhadist martyrs and accept them in The Firdaus

its a big shame the arabs leaders not using their power and money to stop this masacre. God gives them their money to use in a correct way, helping the Ummah.
Allah forgive us, forgive the Ummah and lead the fighters to a Paradise.
Shame on them , shame on the west , shame on the simple people of Israel for being brainwashed and accepting to have their hands with inocent palestinian blood, theiar sellig their future after death.

لا حول و لا قوة الا بالله

kahlil gibran said...

emaratiyah,

i agree israel was always a rogue nation that trained assassins & turned disinformtaion into a fine art. that should make saddam, hamas, hezbollah, gadhafi, ailul al aswad along with some others saints.

please spare us from your theological lectures. it seems you people can't talk logic without invoking some divine power or spiritual hogwash. and if you really want to bring your religious theories into this discussion by portraying yourself as the chosen people, then continue living in dementia instead of using your head.

also, on the topic of oppressed and their right to resist granted by the creator, i presume this right is only restricted to your palestinian muslim brethren and nobody else?

Anonymous said...

From Mexico:To all muslims pray for the palestinian people.

Emaratiya gave the best point 10 stars to you.

hemlock said...

lirun, my last experience with israelis (in 2000/2001) didnt go too well, it was on LGF - im certain you know what im talking about. i dont want to leave a link here ...

but having read various comments by you on the blog, i respect your opinion as an individual.

so i hope you dont mind me putting a question to you, specifically: do you believe in cause and effect? do you, as an Israeli, think Palestinians are retaliating, or do you think they are instigators / trouble makers?

DUBAI JAZZ said...

Israel recovers its military self-esteem by killing civilians:

"“In the cabinet room today there was an energy, a feeling that after so long of showing restraint we had finally acted,” said Mark Regev, spokesman for Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, speaking of the weekly government meeting that he attended. Mark Heller, a senior researcher at the Institute for National Security Studies at Tel Aviv University, said that that energy reflected the deep feeling among average Israelis that the country had to regain its deterrent capacity""

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/29/world/middleeast/29assess.html?ref=middleeast

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

Please don't act you are from the UAE or live here, zionists like yourself are banned from entering the UAE. Eat your heart and crap out ;)

The 1st post was MINE. and I am a proud Emarati, born and raised, who's family is most probably more prominent than yours.

Why I didnt post under my name? I only log into my accounts when Im on my computer. When I am on ANY other one I dont dare. I dont trust anything I dont own.

And I stand by every single word I said. I only stated FACTS. You can let your false bpathos steer you as you wish. If you really cared as you claim, you'd be over there "fighting" instead of siting in (arguably) the safest place on earth as your "brothers" die.

I on the other hand dont pretend. I dont care. I have said it a million times. I dont. All I've ever head is crying about this same issue, and it's tiring.

I'd actually like to donate to the Israelis who are caught in the hamas rocket attackes. No, Im not kidding.

Like I said, only in the Arab world would people who have no country, be allowed to travel freely without passports, only in the arab world would my country PAY for them to have an embassy, and only Arabs would call for helping their "muslim" brothers when I have never met a decent muslim who came from that place.

I'm sorry. I deal in facts, not pathos.

There will be a post up on my blog on this subject soon... you wont want to miss it.

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

as one anonymous writer wrote - we have been around for 60 years as a country and dont plan on disappearing..

>> That was me. Again, I only deal in facts. I can pretend like everyone else, or be reasonable.

The last time that part of the world wasnt muslim, it stayed in the hands of non mslims for... help me here... 180 years? 210? Something like that, Till Salahuddin showed up.

Its been 60ish years, Israel isnt going anywhere soon.

If everyone wants it to be gone, why arent Jordan, Egypt, and Syria attacking Israel with all their might?

Because money is more important that "brotherhood."

So lets stop being silly, barking when we are told to by people who, by all accounts, are really teh scum of the earth. (Talking about the Palestinians here)

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

do you, as an Israeli, think Palestinians are retaliating, or do you think they are instigators / trouble makers?

Dude, Im an Emarati Muslim and I think they are trouble makers.

I must also agree, that besides the average stupidity (that everyone has) Lirun is a pretty level headed guy.

DUBAI JAZZ said...

ABIT bro, what's up with you?

I wonder what kind of experience with Palestinians prompts you to speak of them with such a massive generalization?

You want to deal with facts? Let's talk about facts: the official stance of the UAE, and correct me if I am wrong, is very different from that of your own. The UAE and Shiekh Zayed (may God rest his soul) has always been a staunch supporter of the Palestinian people. In fact, one of the places bombed by Israel yesterday is a mosque named after sheikh Zayed (who had donated the money to build it).

You might think of Palestinians as barking dogs, and I don't know about you, but even suffering dogs will garner my sympathy. Heck, I am sure if those who are getting killed were dogs they will attract more attention and sympathy from some of the commenters here.

Anonymous said...

hamas should face israel face to face and not hide behind their women and children

Arab Lady said...

Anonymous said...
"hamas should face israel face to face and not hide behind their women and children"

give me a break....eft who is hidding now !!!

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

You want to deal with facts? Let's talk about facts: the official stance of the UAE, and correct me if I am wrong, is very different from that of your own. The UAE and Shiekh Zayed (may God rest his soul) has always been a staunch supporter of the Palestinian people. In fact, one of the places bombed by Israel yesterday is a mosque named after sheikh Zayed (who had donated the money to build it).

Sh. Zayed was indeed a great man, and he had his own OPINION on Palestine. the UAE is also due it's own OPINION, as any other nation does. the official stance of a SINGLE or small groupe of nations does not turn that OPINION into a fact.

You didnt list a SINGLE fact.

FACT: Israel is a country, acknowledged by the UN and the majority of the world, INCLUDING a few MUSLIM and ARAB countries (Egypt is a prime example)

FACT: There is NO country on this planet called Palestine.

FACT: more than 10,000 "stateless" Emaratis cannot even leave the UAE's borders for Hajj, yet "Palestinians" who do NOT have ANY passport, but a "Wathiqa" (Document) may travel as they wish.

FACT: "Palestinians" have given the UAE ZERO dollars over their missirable fiasco. the UAE has given BILLIONS.

FACT: Israel has an actual government, a constitution, and a claim to that land. Before Israel, that land was a part of the british mandate of Palestine, a name the British MADE UP. Before 1912, NO "Palestinians" existed. The people who lived there were Jordanians, Syrians, Egyptians, and constituencies (kind of) of the Ottoman Empire.

FACT: the "palestinian" issue stems from the fact that their "leaders" are currupt dogs, and they cant get along with each other.

FACT: You can only be Japanese if there is a Japan, Chinese if there is a China, and German if there is a Germany... So... Palestinians are from...? (Again, there is today, NO country called Palestine.)

FACT: The correct terminology, based on the geographical setting of Gaza would either be Egyptian or Israeli.

FACT: With the absence of either Israeli or Egyptian citizenship, these "stateless peaple" are just that, STATELESS.

I actually dont have anything PERSONALLY against these people. Nor have I gone through one single situation that makes me "hate" them, The exact opposite... I hate NO ONE... and LIKE NO ONE.

I like facts. There isnt a Palestine, and thus there cant be Palestinians. The UN caters to them because they dont know what to do with hem, and Israel is more than kind because if it were me I'd have NUKED Gaza a long long time ago. No, Im not kidding. with how small the area is, and how densely populated it is, I'd have gotten rid of 1.5 million worthless people, and then started talks with the west bank.

ISRAEL being an actual country has an obligation to protect it's people, and if that means genocide, so be it.

"Palestinians" have no such right, as they dont have a country or government that is allowed to do that for them. They have a "president" who is powerless to stop crazy fanatics as they do what they wish.

Again, if YOU feel strongly about this, if YOU care, then YOU should be there HELPING, NOT sitting in your safe ell off house typiing on the computer.

But I dont expect anything from people who bark with drunk sincerity when ordered. You are pathetic and a prime example as to why the human race as a whole is one vile mess.

Oh, and just because you died, doesnt mean you are automatically a MARTYR. There are rules for Martyrdom, ones that sually NEVER are present in the Arab-Israeli conflict.

What else you got?

Anonymous said...

Arabs = Traitors

1. Egypt
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

And so on.....

/end

Lirun said...

ABIT:

i wish i could answer you simply but i cant..

the middle east and particularly where i live is a complex space where people often act not because they want to but because they believe they have no choice..

in many ways the israeli operation is one of those cases.. in many ways i perceive the hamas situation to be similar..

they were not "really" the democratic selection of the palestinians.. election probity aside - the palestinian street (at least the one i know) tells of a party that was chosen not for their military strategy but rather for their social services.. however these services were abandonned very quickly once they got into power..

we pushed them into a terrible zone by not wanting to talk to them.. but frankly they were already there with their manifesto surrounding their intent to destroy israel..

leaving us both onvery high branches of a very tall tree..

when hamas first came into power in gaza and consolidated its grip things almost looked positive.. law and order suddenly seemed like a viable prospect and smiley gazans on the news reported that they felt safer than ever..

but very soon after the rockets resumed and with them gaza lost its sewage system ripped apart to manufacture missiles.. hot houses (left by israel) that were dismantled for rocket material.. piping donated by the kingdom of jordan meeting the same fate.. and much of its finances that were directed to the cause of operating a military orginsation or (during the tahdiye - truce) accumulating weaponry..

at some point israeli banks could no longer deal with the regime so the finances were cut off.. at some point we could no longer facilitate contact with this territory..

everyone believed that the disengagement had the potential to help.. but once we left gaza things got worse.. much worse..

having absorbed 1,000,000 jewish refugees from arab countries - we are no strangers to refugee rehabilitation.. and believed that maybe gaza would focus on its core concerns.. the classic israeli dream for gaza used to be for it to become a mini hong kong of the middle east.. but needless to say that hasnt happened and things have progressively become much much worse..

i was brainstorming with a colleague today as to what we possibly could have done with gaza to arrive at a different result.. and we struggled to come up with a viable option..

i dont think hamas thought their election through to the end.. they recognise us.. they know israel isnt disappearing but they (to the best of my opion) cant figure out how to steer their ship away from their own slogans and disasters..

on the one hand i cant blame them for the death of 300 gazans because bombs paid for with my taxes did it..

but on the other hand - they are calling for my destruction on a daily basis and terrorising israelis non stop - so what were they really expecting "us" to do.. and how long were they expecting our cities to be bombed..

what a mad time..

i urge the international community to help us all find a way to make this situation stop.. a lot of creativity will be necessary.. we're really in a fix.. and we need to shift away from a blame mindset and focus on a mutually sufferable outcome..

Tim Newman said...

We need to unite as Muslims and Arabs and respond in the same language that they understand.

You tried that already, four times. The score stands at 4-0 to Israel. You really want to make it 5-0?

DUBAI JAZZ said...

ABIT,

Check your inbox.

Zafar said...

Tim Newman; yes I do wish that we as Muslims should at least find the courage to make it lets say as you said 5-0, may be 6-0 or n-0 to reach n-1 and then take from there on to the next level when you are disappeared from the map.

Anonymous said...

you arabs
shame on you, shame on you , shame on you
your hypocrisy and double standards are so shameful, while brothers and sisters are suffering a massacre youe liders go to Oman to have a GCC Summit to do what? WHAT????? to talk about how to make more money, how to whaT????
where are the kings? emirs and shaijs???
Palestine have the third Holy Shrine, so who is the Custodian of this Holy Place as the other two has a King?
shame on you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
go go to Shakira concert and go trough the street saying that is haram or this is haram, but when brothers are really needing a hand you hide
shame on you!!!!!!!

UAEyianGirl said...

ABIT-

You call yourself a proud Emarati, and support Zionists?! I dare you to go on a local T.V. and say such stuff!

You watch too much fox TV, which clearly turned you into a zionist thinker, and a terrorist for supporting such aggression on innocent civilians.

All the facts that you've stated reflect the reality of politics, but that doesn't mean they are true in a sense the world agree on.
Spare us your aggressive comments, and zionist stance, and admit you pro zionist!


P.S. Don't underestimate the prominance of my family ;) I wouldn't do that if I were you. I underestimated your anonymous comment just because you were too emm BRAVE or lets say werent' around your PC to comment with your name!

So Kudos for coming out, and please don't refer to yourself as OUR and OUR, you simply represent yourself not the UAE.

UAEyianGirl said...

ABIT-

I don't care to checkout your posts in your blog. Your too pro-zionist for my liking!

LIRUN-

You referred to the incident as a 'terror attack' when a 'terrorist' stapped four ppl...? What do you call what your country is doing to the people in Gaza?

I just think regardless of anyone's difference people should just live and let live!

Anonymous said...

"We need to unite as Muslims and Arabs and respond in the same language that they understand.

You tried that already, four times. The score stands at 4-0 to Israel. You really want to make it 5-0?"

Times have changed, a small rag tag group has defeated isreal already, US the great undefeatable beast is licking its wounds in Iraq and Afghanistan, so the score is 4-1 now, do you ant to see all Muslim countries coming at isreal to kick some:)

Edi神 said...

Those who want to help palestin, please sell all you have and go to GAza and attack israel because I heard they are running out of Virgin *up there* lol!

Veiled Muslimah said...

Innillahi wa inna ilayhi rajioun.

Ya rabb... :'( When will it stop.

MT said...

honestly. these views above are highly highly disturbing. talk of nuking 1.5 million people. talk of a certain group as being equated to dogs? really?

the very premise of the formation of a country being "its a promised land" is absurd. the 'fact' that the world recognizes this right does not make it correct. my great great great great grandparents adam and eve roamed the world - hence i guess i can now claim the entire arabian peninsula as mine coz of its my "promised land".

i won't comment on hamas. lets assume for the sake of argument they are wat everyone here refers them to be. are the israelis any better? really? one friend above suggests donating to the israelis? y? there may be good people everywhere even in isreal - i agree. but there are some SERIOUSLY WACKED OUT RELIGIOUS EXTREMIST LUNATICS in israel. and they are in power via coalition govts. they think blockading an entire population of 1.5 million and denying them power and food is a logical way of dealing with a single group of people throwing fireworks at them.

i believe that blockading an entire population so that they are deprived of food, medicine and running water is inhumane - and that sm readers of this blog feel its the right thing to do is disturbing.

whether the place these ppl lived in was called palestine or not is just an absolutely idiotic argument. the FACT my friends was there were HUMANS living there in 1912 and many many years before that. there was no need to change that status quo and end up kicking people out of their homes to create a new jewish state. i wonder how many ppl commenting here wud be fine if i walked into their house kicked em out coz well...... its my promised land :)

premise of creation of a jewish state based on it being a promised land - ABSURD. the 'FACT' the world recognizes that right and is fine with natives being kicked out - even more ABSURD. y shud the natives of the area have to pay the price of the west's guilt over gassing jews in the World war????

Lirun said...

UAEyianGirl

i want people to live and let live as well..

so does our medical system which is why we treat palestinians who accidentally prematurely detonate themselves.. which is why hamas casualties are coming into israel and which is why rambam hospital in haifa had hizbulla casualties during the war with lebanon..

this whole place is so screwed up..

so many lives are spent on this rubbish.. so much good could have been done with these lives..

Emaratiya said...

This thread is getting convoluted and terribly long. Too many issues are being interwoven. I'll try to weed out what I can for responses here...

1. Gee, Kahlil Gibran, I will not reply to profanity especially that aimed at the dead people. Sorry if it disturbs you. Cromwell killed thousands in the name of religion, fundamentalism to be exact, and the British honor him. Well, thank you for proving my point, as for Palestinians they are already winners in resisting such aggression.

2.Blessing in tragedy...WOW. After reading your comments I have discovered that you are really an uninformed little boy, who is just regurgitating some "rebellious" stuff he read in a book/blog some were. Enjoying being completely irrelevant and amounting to nothing in life!

Idiots like you don’t know the intricacies & complexity of geopolitics in the region; kindly keep your opinion to yourself...you have NO IDEA what’s going on…. If you have nothing important to say, don't respond. You can move along now.

3.Anonymous…you must be kidding about hamas hiding behind kids and women. Reality check idiot, it’s Israelis that won’t face the enemy, insurgents, terrorists, freedom fighters whatever you call them. They bomb them using f16 jets and drones flown by computer in facilities thousands of miles away. As far as I can see the Muslim brothers, or whatever you call them, go into battle prepared to die. So tell me now who is the pussy cat?


The Israelis may encounter shocking news. The biggest shock will be when they discover that the US no longer needs them. This may sound strange, but you can look to the global economic collapse as the force which will dictate the turn in history for the Middle East. When economies collapse only nations which possess natural resources like us Muslims will play the tunes: just look at those who own the oil and natural gas and you'll see what I mean.

For all the Muslims who are reading it, we live in very hard times so let’s assist one another love one another and be awliyah for one another. Don’t take much merit to live side by side in harmony and peace because we are living turbulent times of genocide and endless war. Arabs are too high on the American fed medicine of co-existence and recognizing the “other” that does not recognize us at all.

Allah says in the Qur'an:'with regard to a believer, they respect not the ties, either of kinship or of covenant! It is they who are the transgressors.' this verse explains the Israeli people. Israel is the real threat to the peace of this world.

Anonymous said...

yes, as somebody said above, the score was 0-4, yes dear, you are right but times have changed, and the wars can't be win by weapons as barbarics americans or genocides israelis tried
lebanon 1 israel 0
Iraq 1 americans 0
and still there wininng more 0 the same as in Afganistan, but now the wars can be win with money, here the problem are the corrupted and veryyy rich arabs shaijs , kings and emirs not helping their brothers, not helping the Ummah , Allah Gave to them their power and money to be used in the correct way.... but this is other topic, but imagine if this arab big money were quit of the american or western banks..... the west and Israel will collapse, arabs goverments have better and more powerful weapons than a missil, their money, but they are too greed and corrupted to use and share them.
Allah forbide us and forbide them. The only that I can wish for the Palestine people from my humble place is The Paradise for them. May Allah lead all of these martyrs to the Paradise and hell for their enemies

Proud Emirati said...

The Zionist existence in Palestine is a mistake that needs to be corrected. Everything else is a result for this mistake !

Anonymous said...

To anonymous at 13.09:

Just a point of fact, Hezbollah didn't beat Israel. Israel just didn't achieve its stated aim in Lebanon. It did however, succeed in killing thousands of Lebanese people, a a few dozen Israelis for no real reason. Nobody won, in fact everyone was a loser in that particular pointless conflict.

Invading Israel and kicking them out? You really think that this is possible. It is one thing battening down the hatches against a country which doesn't particularly want to invade and stay, and another overthrowing and overunning a country.

Two diametrically opposed sides, with blinkered beliefs and the mindset that violence and rhetoric is more important than human lives.

It makes me sad to hear people talking about rising up, and using force, but even more so to hear people who live in the UAE - a living model of how negotiation, reason and political neutrality can breed peace and stability -proclaiming violence as a viable solution. 60 years of violence and what has it achieved, other than making undertakers' on both sides very rich?

Anonymous said...

Simple question. When Palestine was divided into Egypt and Jordan. Were people fighting for a viable Palestinian state?

Anonymous said...

Lirun. Caring for the wounded without predjudice is called social responsibility. If you do it in Israel then it is something to be proud of.

The country has a lot to be ashamed of right now.

samuraisam said...

What a productive discussion.

Anonymous said...

@ Lirun, no reaction to MT's words? Please, humour us.

Lirun said...

MT

1,000,000 jews cleansed out of arab countries between 1947 and the seventies.. to the extent that now the arab world matches hitler's wettest dream of being judenrein..

dont look to the european gassing for our disagreement.. look to how jews all over the middle east were treated by the regimes they lived in.. humilitated massacred rounded up stripped off their property and generally treated like shit even after contributing for centuries to those lands and their muslim neighbours.. which in many cases came after them..

jews of iraq lived there for 2600 years.. well before the arab invasion and well before islam.. same with egypt and same with other countries that later expelled them in projectile fashion giving them one way stamps out of their states..

when did you or your forefather deplore what you did to us.. when did you generate your fragile human rights bone?

the answer is never..

you dont have one..

jewish blood is cheap.. 300 rockets a week flying into israel is fine.. you expect us to swallow your shit just as we did for 1500 years of muslim rule..

sorry.. 300 rockets in one week is not ok.. nor was 3000 rockets all of last year (notwithstanding the tahdiye - temporary ceasefire)..

there are limits to how long we are prepared to sit as your ducks..

and if you want the violence to stop - get up off your ass and next time hamas send s a rocket protest! tell the world how worried you are about the fate of the people in gaza..

if the hamas is a slight minority then the people should do something about it and run them out of town.. but on the other hand if the people solidly support hamas as the rallies seemed to indicate - then yes we have a proper war.. which we are entitled to have with a territory that floods us with missiles..

if you think we then owe them electricity food and medical care like some people are suggesting then you clearly are detached from reality.. i would like to see you offer someone medical attention (which we do) after they lob 300 rockets at you in a week.. and if you think its only fireworks then i invite you to come and spend the next month in sderot and appreciate these fireworks.. maybe even try catching some with your hands..

if the gazans need infrastructure - why dont they turn to the people they arent fighting ie egypt.. why are they coming to those that they are threatening ie israel..

is something here not counter intuitive to you?

Anonymous said...

A Blessing in Tragedy? A more appropriate appellation would be a Disgrace in Tragedy.

Anonymous said...

For all the arabs we sit on their asses and watch this you will pay a heavy price,you bunch of sheep,who sit and talk bullshit and smoke shisha like jerks.
You are pathetic,you are men withour spinal cord ,you call yourself muslims .Shame on you all.

I watch a clip of whats happening on the streets of gaza and i am digusted to know that we are allowing the jews to do this to our kind,our own blood .

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=45915856105&oid=41092709610#/video/video.php?v=45915856105&oid=41092709610

The clip above,will wake you up a bit,and stop listening to your governemnt and figth ,protest and show your anger like ever before.



If you dont get the message,you will sooner or later,you just need an earth quake to wake you up and suffer like the palestinian.

I curse u arabs day and nigth.

hemlock said...

sam, i was getting sick reading posts on salik and rents... they kill the art of debate.

folks like ABIT and Lirun offer alternative opinions and something to think about.

so yeay for 66 comments. *shrugs*

ٌرحيـــــــــــــــــــــــل said...

بصـــــراحة حماس حماسهم الزائد عن اللزوم خطأ كبيــــــــــــر، أنا مع حماس لكني أتمنى أن تكون خطواتهم "أذكى" لأنهم مؤخرا ما سببوا أي ضرر يذكر للإسرائيلين بالعكس أضروا بأبناء وطنهم لو كانوا استعدوا وخططوا كانوا عالأقل في مقابل الدمار اللي حل بهم حققوا دمار نسبي للعدو، عشوائية حماس أضرت بالغزاويين...
الحين التبرعات بتستلمها فتح و ابقوا قابلوني لو استفاد المتضررين في غزة بأكثر من 5% أو أقل لأن الباقي بتبلعه فتح
يعني حماس سوت اللي فراسها و فتح تستلم مبالغ وقدرها كمساعدات والغزاويين المساكين راحت عليهم ....
أتمنــــــــــــــى ان اللي حصل يكون درس لحماس

Proud Emirati said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Proud Emirati said...

so shush to anyone who says that Gaza is not our concern. The consolidation came from the highest levels

Mohammad orders cancellation of New Year celebrations

WAM
Published: December 30, 2008, 20:37
Dubai:

His Highness Shaikh Mohammad Bin Rashid Al Maktoum, Vice-President and Prime Minister of the UAE and Ruler of Dubai, has ordered the cancellation of His Highness Shaikh Mohammad Bin Rashid Al Maktoum, Vice-President and Prime Minister of the UAE and Ruler of Dubai, has ordered the cancellation of all New Year celebrations on Wednesday as an act of solidarity with the Palestinian people.

In support of the Palestinians in Gaza, who are enduring all kinds of killing, destruction and displacement by the Israeli military machinery, Shaikh Mohammad instructed all concerned authorities in Dubai to put this order in place and take necessary procedures to circulate the decision to all concerned parties.

hemlock said...

Proud Emirati: I'm so totally in no mood to party... and i'm glad Shk Mo feels the same way.

Stained said...

Ditto to Hemlock....

Anonymous said...

ABIT-

You call yourself a proud Emarati, and support Zionists?! I dare you to go on a local T.V. and say such stuff!

And where did I say I was pro zionist? I am anti bullshit, and this whole "palestinian" crap is bullshit.

I would if I didnt live in a communist country.

Oh, and btw, because of who my father is, I HAVE said these things in front of a MEMBER OF THE RULING FAMILY and I got a smirk out of him. We had the Ex minister of justice over (when he was the minister) and I voiced my same views. I dont hide. I dont have to. He disagreed with me, but thats what a good conversation is made of.

This is what many thinks but doesnt say. Are these people my family? my country men? no, therefore I dont care.

I'm sorry if I havent been brainwashed to bark and salivate the second a bell is rung.

They "may" be my muslim brothers, but seriously, as I once stated, I have seen the WORST examples of Islam out of these people.

Irrelevant? Going nowhere? Trust me honey, I am more important, better educated, and going places much faster than you ever will. The fact that you are an Emarati woman on the internet bitching says alot of your upbringing and status. Non-existent.

hemlock said...
sam, i was getting sick reading posts on salik and rents... they kill the art of debate.

folks like ABIT and Lirun offer alternative opinions and something to think about.

Ah! Someone who can actually accept an opposing view and not turn into a crybaby? I like you. kind of. However, please note the differences in Lirun and my arguements. He is pro Israeli. I am not, I am being realistic. Deep down I'd like Isreal to stop being, maybe. But that isnt going to happen in the next 50 or so years.

As I have said a few times, Im not AGAINST or FOR either side. Im against bullshit, deal with facts, and am REALISTIC. You can mouth off all you want, but Israel isnt going anywhere soon, not when Turkey , the KSA, and Egypt are knee deep in aid and/or trade with the US. Not gonna happen.

The world is based on NOTHING other than money, and Im sorry if reality hurts some but money is (apparently) much more important than a few thousand lives.

Also, as with the whole mumbai thing, how many Palestinians (I USED THE WORD!!!) have been killed since the start of the 2nd "Intifada?"

under 6000. Im sorry, but over 140,000 lost their lives in that tsunami a while back, you all didnt bitch about that nearly as much as you are here.

SHAME ON YOU.

I really dont care. I dont. I have my own issues, and you all probably have yours. If you can live with yourselves being half sincere when you are expected to, fine, so be it.

I dont care and dont pretend to, and am really annoyed at how much time and money is wasted on this issue.

Yes smarty, people DID live there in 1912. and that land was LOST by the turks to the UK in a WAR. a victor in a war gets all teh SPOILS. and the UK did exactly what they wanted with their spoils of war.

It's how wars were always conducted, and to some extent, always will be.

Kyle said...

What a productive discussion.

Samuraisam:

I was about to say that but you beat me to it ;)

What do you say, we touch base with a 100+ comments and this whole thing will still be spinning in a limbo past mid-tomorrow-night ;)

I don't know about you or anybody else here canceling celebrations but we're going to welcome Oh-Nine with a bang. And just in case any one's curious, it's to debunk negativity and chase all those funky (oh-eight) demons away.

Best wishes to you, one and all :)

Hemlock:

I agree with your (12/30/2008 at 21:37) note.

Best to you and your own for 2009 & ahead :)

Emaratiyah said...

PE I was just going to say that! I am so happy that Sh. Mohammed decided on that, so wise of him, and so empathic.

Love him.

fellow atheist said...

Lirun,

I understand the average Israeli's sentiment. The problem of course, is not who started first. The problem is, how can we go on? I think everyone agrees that the current situation is not the most desirable of options.

I tend to think of Israel as a rogue state, in the sense that it does not answer to International Law. This is not a secret. It considers its situation to be unique that it cannot be held accountable by international standards.

I am not a Hamas fan. In fact, I am not fan of any faith-based organization. This obviously includes a healthy dose of Israeli government as well. The whole region is run by religious fanatics. Hamas is no exception.

You cannot want to have a proper democracy and not expect the Islamists to win. They are populist movements by their very nature.

I don't think people in Gaza are anymore anti-Hamas than an Israeli is anti-current-coalition-government. I think Hamas does represent the Palestinian population in Gaza adequately. Their hopes, dreams and hatred. It is not as organized and composed as Israel's hatred. It has a flare to it, doesn't it?

So how do we get out of this? An all-out-war is an option. However, if this war doesn't completely wipe out Hamas and find a true and viable alternative where lives of ordinary Palestinians are quickly and visibly improved. If this cannot be done, then all this bloodshed is for nothing.

There are, of course, the long-term solutions. Those are near impossible to achieve with fundamentalists on both sides.

I think this war is our actual only hope for this conflict to come to an end. Will Israel see it through properly, or will it just do it just to punish Palestinians?

Sugar-Free Sweetie said...

Great move by His Highness...Emaratiya, you have done heck of a job putting what I have in mind into words...sriously some people don't even know what's going on...they just skipped on reading so many pages of the Palestine-Isreal conflict, and then act as what we would call in our language as Razza>>>>


I wouldn't want to go through all that everyone has already mentioned, but I would like to quote Sir Winston Churchill on what he said To the Palestine Royal Commission (1937); simply to let you know the basis of the Isreali Existance:

"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place."

And if they can admit that a wrong has been done to the Native Americans, and if the Native people of Australia can get an apology for the stolen generations then why can't the Palestanians get their rights to live in dignity???!!!

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

As a muslim country, there shouldnt even be a new year celebrations.

But then again, this country sold it's Islam a long long time ago.

biscuitinabasket said...

@lirun

I want to make the following comment. Please read it completely before replying - can we do this? My comment is not only directed at you, but also at every other commenter to this post.

Let me ask you this - and this is very very hypothetical - but hear me out ok? (I see you are a lawyer, so I also assume you have more than fresh air between your ears :) )

I know that in Judaism, you have a day of fasting which lasts for about 25 hours. Now multiply that 100 times, heck 50 times. Can you imagine how hunger would feel?

Let me give you another angle. Have you had anyone suffer from cancer in your family? How about heart attack? Have you seen a child ever suffer from a bad flu, or high fever, and noticed how uneasy and troubled they get with a "trivial" condition? If you have, you will know what their suffering is and what relief medicine will give to the ailment (correct me if I am wrong about this assumption, ok?). Now just imagine, that you have to wait for permission to get medical aid... and then you die waiting after waiting for 6 weeks. Is that fair? Is it fair that a child loses its life fighting an illness (lets say asthama for sake of argument) because someone tells them for 6 weeks that they need permission to take medicine.

I am not for one moment supporting the actions of Hamas - let me make that clear, ok? But we have to make one thing clear - I agree that Israel left Gaza to the Palestinians, no argument there. However, you and I will both agree that all food, water, oil, fuel comes via the borders which have been closed for some time now. These supplies come in very sporadically at best. When you go through all that I have described above, I think an average HUMAN will behave irrationally. You are a lawyer, so you will agree that in your profession you come across witnesses who are mentally uncapable to stand trial. These people those who are fed and get medical treatments for their illnesses. So you can just imagine the psychological damage that the people of Gaza are suffering because of the lack of necesities?

I think both Palestinians and Israelis, Muslims and Jews - however you want to look at it - both have to agree one thing - the problem is on both sides - hear me out, ok?

In my opinion - I strongly believe that if Israel opens the borders to Gaza and lets aid and supplies through, there will not be any need for rocket attacks, or attacks of any sorts. If this logic is applied, then it is up to the Palestinians to ensure that they honour their part of the deal (and i am sure that they will). What we cannot do however, is argue the fact that Israel will not give people food and water, and inturn Palestinians will sit quietly suffering.

My final point. I want you to tell me something with your hand on heart, and mind on the Torah (because it is one of the four holy books, and it speaks the truth) - If you as Israel were in the Palestinian position, and Palestine was in your postition (of power), and if the situation was as it is today - how would you react as a distressed Israeli?

I look look forward and appreciate your comments :)

p.s. - If any of my comments seem sarcastic - they are not meant to be sarcastic. I am just trying to make a serious and if possible a logical comment. I do not believe that the fighting will resolve anything, and I think that there are enough educated and sane people commenting on this post to understand and identify what both sides need to do. There should not be a "you first" approach to this; it should be a mutual approach.

biscuitinabasket said...

@lirun

I want to make the following comment. Please read it completely before replying - can we do this? My comment is not only directed at you, but also at every other commenter to this post.

Let me ask you this - and this is very very hypothetical - but hear me out ok? (I see you are a lawyer, so I also assume you have more than fresh air between your ears :) )

I know that in Judaism, you have a day of fasting which lasts for about 25 hours. Now multiply that 100 times, heck 50 times. Can you imagine how hunger would feel?

Let me give you another angle. Have you had anyone suffer from cancer in your family? How about heart attack? Have you seen a child ever suffer from a bad flu, or high fever, and noticed how uneasy and troubled they get with a "trivial" condition? If you have, you will know what their suffering is and what relief medicine will give to the ailment (correct me if I am wrong about this assumption, ok?). Now just imagine, that you have to wait for permission to get medical aid... and then you die waiting after waiting for 6 weeks. Is that fair? Is it fair that a child loses its life fighting an illness (lets say asthama for sake of argument) because someone tells them for 6 weeks that they need permission to take medicine.

I am not for one moment supporting the actions of Hamas - let me make that clear, ok? But we have to make one thing clear - I agree that Israel left Gaza to the Palestinians, no argument there. However, you and I will both agree that all food, water, oil, fuel comes via the borders which have been closed for some time now. These supplies come in very sporadically at best. When you go through all that I have described above, I think an average HUMAN will behave irrationally. You are a lawyer, so you will agree that in your profession you come across witnesses who are mentally uncapable to stand trial. These people those who are fed and get medical treatments for their illnesses. So you can just imagine the psychological damage that the people of Gaza are suffering because of the lack of necesities?

I think both Palestinians and Israelis, Muslims and Jews - however you want to look at it - both have to agree one thing - the problem is on both sides - hear me out, ok?

In my opinion - I strongly believe that if Israel opens the borders to Gaza and lets aid and supplies through, there will not be any need for rocket attacks, or attacks of any sorts. If this logic is applied, then it is up to the Palestinians to ensure that they honour their part of the deal (and i am sure that they will). What we cannot do however, is argue the fact that Israel will not give people food and water, and inturn Palestinians will sit quietly suffering.

My final point. I want you to tell me something with your hand on heart, and mind on the Torah (because it is one of the four holy books, and it speaks the truth) - If you as Israel were in the Palestinian position, and Palestine was in your postition (of power), and if the situation was as it is today - how would you react as a distressed Israeli?

I look look forward and appreciate your comments :)

p.s. - If any of my comments seem sarcastic - they are not meant to be sarcastic. I am just trying to make a serious and if possible a logical comment. I do not believe that the fighting will resolve anything, and I think that there are enough educated and sane people commenting on this post to understand and identify what both sides need to do. There should not be a "you first" approach to this; it should be a mutual approach.

Mars said...

some of my comments might not be relevant to the post - but here goes:

1) Why must Emiratis be forced to have a pack mentality? As ABIT says, it is the opinion of the State, and opinion of it's people. And not everyone can or should have the same opinion, unless they want it.

2) I generally hate debates on this blog because it degenerates to name-calling, getting personal, and being over passionate. a debate is about reiterating facts, and to a certain extent, expressing opinions and the person's point of view objectively.

3) I honestly have stopped caring. Even the India attacks didn't affect me as much even though I'm Indian and my mother recently went to India.

4)As for the Palestine-Israel conflict, it isn't going to end anytime soon until both parties can behave in a civilized manner and negotiate it out. Violence is never the answer. And frankly, I'm rather sick of people telling me to care or guilting me into care by saying I'm a horrid person/Muslim etc. I have my issues and concerns - this conflict is not one of it. I'm more interested in educating people and helping them help themselves - if they care to.

5) I agree with people who say that if you really give a rat's ass about Gaza, you'd go there and help, instead of sitting here moaning about it. Actions speak louder than words.

BuJassem said...

Dubai Jazz. ya3teek alf 3afye for this excellent post.

Israeli generals and ministers like Ehud Barak need to be taken to justice in the same way the Nazis were after WWII.. although I honestly prefer what Hitler himself got..

Anonymous said...

I grew up in Northern Ireland and when asked about 'the troubles', used to say "i don't care about either side anymore. If they want to go around looking for reasons to kill, why should I worry about it? When both sides want peace the people spouting violence will eventually lose and the people wanting to talk will win. I don't care who was right or wrong anymore, I'm just want to live my life without hearing another kid in my neighbourhood has died."

Wonder if that moment will hit the Middle East (from both sides)?

ٌرحيـــــــــــــــــــــــل said...

I think we "Arabs" should stop being emotional and seek logical solutions to Pals issue because as it's clear Israel will always be there and Pals have to be smarter about dealing and fighting against it. Jews are smart and well organized, Pals can't agree among themselves and their actions aren't well planned, they can't even get along among themselves which makes it hard for them to conquer.I hope what have happened is a lesson for all of us that if we want to take our enemy down we have to be keen, organized and with a plan. Hamas shot their extra rockets and Fateh won the aids money and the poor Gaza ppl got the disaster part. I think they should rebel against Fateh and Hamas and form a united front.

DUBAI JAZZ said...

The pseudo peace-dove, the faithful servant and dedicated agent of the zionist state continues to spread lies and propaganda:

1,000,000 jews cleansed out of arab countries between 1947 and the seventies.. to the extent that now the arab world matches hitler's wettest dream of being judenrein..

You dare to compare Arabs with Nazis? Arab jews have largely migrated to Israel out of their own desire. There is still a Jewish community in Syria, Egypt, Yemen, Morroco and even Iran, Arabs must be lousy at cleansing if they haven't finished with the whole lot by now, huh?

And while we're at it, would you care to provide links?

Here's a link for those who really want to learn about some of the Arab Jews.
http://joshualandis.com/blog/?p=656

It's your own state, its racist foundations and supremacist attitude, that is worth likening to the Nazis.

Here's what some of your leaders said and continue to say about Arabs:

“We must expel Arabs and take their places.” — David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.

“There is no such thing as a Palestinian people… It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn’t exist.”– Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

“Any one who speaks in favor of bringing the Arab refugees back must also say how he expects to take the responsibility for it, if he is interested in the state of Israel. It is better that things are stated clearly and plainly: We shall not let this happen.” — Golda Meir, 1961, in a speech to the Knesset, reported in Ner, October 1961

“This country exists as the fulfillment of a promise made by God Himself. It would be ridiculous to ask it to account for its legitimacy.”– Golda Meir, Le Monde, 15 October 1971

DUBAI JAZZ said...

And Lirun, just for the heck of it, let's listen to what this Iranian Jew (one should wonder how he's still alive eh?) has to say about the real business of ethnic cleansing in the region:

Just as the traditional American cowboy film presented white Americans under siege, with Indians as the aggressors, which was the opposite of reality, so, too, have Palestinians become the aggressors and not the victims. Beginning in 1948, 750,000 Palestinians were deliberately cleansed and expelled from their homes, and hundreds of their villages were destroyed, and their land was settled by colonists, who went on to deny their very existence and wage a 60-year war against the remaining natives and the national liberation movements the Palestinians established around the world. Every day, more of Palestine is stolen, more Palestinians are killed. To call oneself an Israeli Zionist is to engage in the dispossession of entire people. It is not that, qua Palestinians, they have the right to use any means necessary, it is because they are weak. The weak have much less power than the strong, and can do much less damage. The Palestinians would not have ever bombed cafes or used home-made missiles if they had tanks and airplanes. It is only in the current context that their actions are justified, and there are obvious limits.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/dec/29/gaza-hamas-israel

Proud to be Muslim said...

@ A Disgrace in Tragedy,

"I really dont care. I dont. I have my own issues, and you all probably have yours. If you can live with yourselves being half sincere when you are expected to, fine, so be it.".

Yes, we all have our issues, but we are not all as self-centered as you are. Shame on YOU.

Oh, and don't sit on judgment on our sincerity. You are not qualified.

Now, be a good boy will ya, go back play with your cars and boys toys. Ta.

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

1) Why must Emiratis be forced to have a pack mentality? As ABIT says, it is the opinion of the State, and opinion of it's people. And not everyone can or should have the same opinion, unless they want it.

Oh then you dont understand the "arab" mentality. You are with "us" or against "us." There is NO room for free thought.

Sadly Abu Dhabi spent upwards of 2 MILLION dirhams on my education. So if anyone is to blame for my "incorrect" views... ADIA paid for my education. I was taught to THINK, ASK, and ASK some more. and Im sorry, but hardly anyone hear is dealing in facts. all I see is childish bitching. You dont like what Israel is doing? Ill buy you an m16 and a ticket there to fight. Hope you come back in less than 200 pieces.

Of course, the "us" in the above explanation changes to the whim of pathos faster than a dual ball bearing turbocharger spools.

It's not even funny. I didnt know that the UAE was a "Palestinian" province.

Pathetic. You all may buy into this propaganda, and wish to force false caring on others, but it doesnt work.

I think we "Arabs" should stop being emotional and seek logical solutions to Pals issue because as it's clear Israel will always be there and Pals have to be smarter about dealing and fighting against it. Jews are smart and well organized, Pals can't agree among themselves and their actions aren't well planned, they can't even get along among themselves which makes it hard for them to conquer.I hope what have happened is a lesson for all of us that if we want to take our enemy down we have to be keen, organized and with a plan. Hamas shot their extra rockets and Fateh won the aids money and the poor Gaza ppl got the disaster part. I think they should rebel against Fateh and Hamas and form a united front.

EXACTLY! 1st we have to accept that Israel isnt, for the next 50 years at least, going anywhere. Then Abbas and his "government" needs to JOIN Israel and ERADICATE Hamas, Fatah, and every other "group" (terrorists)

Then and only then, will you have a single government who can actually look out for those people. When a spokes woman for Abbas was asked on CNN yesterday if they had any contact with Hamas, she answered no.

Get rid of them, and build a real country.

Then take all these leaches from the UAE back there... oh wait... Israel wont allow that... and most of them would never go... why go back home when you can get fat right here.

If you got the getting "fat" thing, I applaud you.

Dubai Jazz. I dont thingk anyone (but maybe Lirn) is arguing that Israel HAS done wrong. but as we say in Arabic, Illi fat, mat. Whats past is dead. no matter what you type here, say, do, or think. ISRAEL IS GOING TO BE HERE FOR AT LEAST THE NEXT 50 YEARS.

Get that in your head, and start working around it.

A Blessing in Tragedy said...

And Lirun, just for the heck of it, let's listen to what this Iranian Jew (one should wonder how he's still alive eh?) has to say about the real business of ethnic cleansing in the region:

Actually, Iran acknowledges the Jewish community there and guarantees one Jewish seat in their assembly. It is reserved for the Jewish delegate.

Its funny how Iran is the regions most democratic (closest anyways) country, mush more so than Israel (harline Islamic country with a seat at the table for their jews) yet the west always finds something wrong with them.

Lirun said...

fellow atheist:

i hope was isnt our only answer.. however sadly once we enter it all other channels are seemingly blocked.. mind you this only above the ground.. under ground our leaders will no doubt be talking.. just as they always do..

i hope we all grow up and realise this madness is unsustainable and that the world has better things to deal with than a protractable conflict that no party will sufficiently commit to resolving..

biscuit:

thank you for your comment.. your were entirely respectful and i saw no sarcasm in your words..

its an interesting point that you raise and my answer will be a challenge for your mainstream arab to swallow..

we have been "distressed israelis" always.. anti jewish massacres started early in the piece.. way before the establishment of israel as a state and way before the jewish population had significantly bubbled throgh the influx of serious migration..

in the 1930s the entire arab world boycotted us and we were stranded with no trade and supply lines..

during the forties and the fifties we continued to wallow in hunger.. my father's family in jerusalem received only one egg a day.. my father is consequently of reasonable hight whereas my uncle remained short as he was in fact malnourished as a child.. my grandmother on my mothers side couldnt leave the house to get to hospital when she was pregnant with my uncle so she adlibbed the birth on her own as here was a strict curfew in telaviv at that stage.. my uncle fell off his cot and smashed his head when british bullets flew into their house and suffered permanent damage..

let me not drag this too long because i can go on and it gets worse..

we were hungry isolated and impoverished and the jewish refugees from arab countries that dubai jazz says came at their own will leaving massive fortunes behind that were nationalised by local regimes to live in tents in mud fields instead (which dubai jazz thinks they "chose" to do but rather) they only chose to do because that was a far superior option to being chased on flat roof tops across bahgdad and tripoli etc.. and yet what did we do? we worked damn hard.. no one sought to maintain the miserable status quo.. my grandmother who fled sudan and was chased out of yaffo when her sisters house was destroyed one night by local arabs - barely clad in night gowns - never looked back.. they worked hard in whatever they could do.. living in conditions that now look like gaza 7 people in a one room apartment with a shower tap outside for all 20 inhabitants of the building and one kitchennette not even fit for making sandwiches..

the laughed at their own misery and found whatever joy they could in being alive and my grandma who never even finished school worked as a telephone switch operator for 50 years day in day out to feed her children and make sure no one went without.. and her children did the same and we emerged from hell into a paradise buildt out of our sweat and blood..

thats what we did when we were desparate.. all the while fighting off 7 armies when we anounced our independence in accordance with the UN resolution.. and later facing conflict after conflict.. taxed to the hilt to defend this tiny slither of land..

we took our desparation and made something of it.. and today you have the intel chip - the cell phone - articifial insemination - voicemail - sophisticated billing systems - the disk on key - noninvasive digestive cameras - drip agriculture - cd rom and countless other output to be thankful for..

dont be fooled by my tourist campaign.. we are not gods gift to the world.. let me tell you from the inside.. we have many issues to resolve internally as well as externally..

but as much as people want to paint us as the regional pariah - i can assure you this - if the people of every accusing state were to check themselves first - not for the past - just for the present - they would wish their lucky stars that people in their country could enjoy the same freedoms they enjoy in ours..

go see how the lebanese treat their palestinians restricted from dealing in any reasonable profession whereas we have members of parliament lawyers and our hospitals are aflush with arab israelis many of whom are self defined palestinian..

go see how the refugees of jordan live and compare them to those in shuafat and jenin and you will see how much better they have it in jenin..

even when the gazans breached the egyptian border the egyptian were mortified by how much wealthier even the gazans were over the palestinians of the north sinai who suddenly bought all of their stocks and goods only to sell half of them back for tripple the amount..

when jordan donated piping to gaza to rebuild its sewage systems - why didnt they? andhow can they cry now about their sewage explosions and lack of treatment.. they bomb the very israeli power plant that sends them electricty.. three rockets were targeted at and landed within its preccinct! are you suggesting we need to both fix the damage foot thebill and then continue to send them energy?!!? that we pay a premium for anyway because naturally arab countries dont sell us energy resources? how many ends does a raw stick have?!?!

dubai jazz:

you can deny the tragedy of the middle eastern jewery all you like.. syria has but a handful and the hundreds of thousands of moroccan jews are nowhere to be found except israel and france..

i have been to morocco and love that country for what it is.. now.. but the synagogues stand decrepid and the old jewish quarters are santised of jews.. essaouirra once had 14 thousand jews.. and now has but 4 families..

yes what the arab nations did to jews was definitely as bad as the nazis only far more total..

except for a community in iran which itself is a mere fraction of what was once one of the largest communities of jews outside israel - the muslim world is virtually jew-free..

i will be posting about this tomorrow on my blog if you need to read more.. but as a jew who partly hails from middle eastern heritage and whose family ranked amongst its spiritual leaders i know our history..

so dont go blaming the germans buddy.. you guys beat them at their game..

BUT that is history and today we have a new tragedy..

take shuafat refugee camp - a camp built on the traditional lands of arab shuafat within the ring of greater jerusalem.. these people need to start living normal lives.. they'reon palestinian land anyway.. whynot pave their roads.. why not sort out their own sewage and regulate their local tax contributions.. why notlive and negotiate your terms through dignity and productivity rather than riots and violence..

we need to both be willing to use the mouth instead of the gun if dialog is to ever become a viable option..

and it has to be.. because as so many wiser people said here.. violence leads to no peace..

Anonymous said...

emaratiya

way to go girl, all i have to say you said it for me .Inshallah victory for palestine.

Your sister in Islam

Burkina Faso

Anonymous said...

Want peace in the world ? What are you gonna do about it ? :)


Street protests may help. But what is interesting about all those street prostests you see on TV is that there are ALOT of VERY DETERMINED people there.

So ?

Say hello to prayer.

Those two things, "very determined", and "many people people gathered in one place, in the name of the same ideea", are things that prayer likes alot.


So, street protests are good, but what about street protests + prayer ? Or even better, prayer... at the street protest :)

Think about the potential of focusing all that HUUUGE emotional energy onto something, something... supernatural.


And if you arent into street protests - try mass prayer. Mass as in many people at once, not necesarily located in the same place, but focusing, and praying for peace, all at the same time.


For those who dont belive that prayers work, or are into new age things like the law of attraction and stuff, check this out:

Here is a guy (Gregg Braden) who has re-discovered "The lost mode of prayer" that he claims was taught even by Jesus.

And here he explains it, and he actually talks about how to pray for peace:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYIe0h-cB0Y


Here are the reviews of his book, "The Isaiah Effect", reading the reviews you can understand this mode of prayer:
http://www.amazon.com/review/product/060980796X/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?_encoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1


Also some guy who had a near-death-experience was told by "The powers that be", that the prayer of a group of twenty could save a country from war.

Soooo lets get our groups together and pray ! :)


If you are dedicated you could even pray for peace every day at a fixed hour, and anounce it somewhere, so that others can join you and acheve the group effect.

Lirun said...

dubai jazz:

http://emspeace.blogspot.com/2008/12/forgotten-refugees.html this is for you

UAEyainGirl said...

TO ABIT, a pro Zionist living in denial…
This reply is soly dedicated to your so-called facts you’ve stated in your previous comment.


“FACT: more than 10,000 "stateless" Emaratis cannot even leave the UAE's borders for Hajj, yet "Palestinians" who do NOT have ANY passport, but a "Wathiqa" (Document) may travel as they wish.”

--Incase you don’t watch the news, and you don’t know the status particularly the people in Gaza, they are banned from traveling in and out, with no food or medicine… Specfically this year they weren’t allowed to go for Hajj, so the comment you said is based on nothing. Common’ don’t compare the ‘stateless’ not emarati people with the Palestinians. There is no comparison, and you comparing the two just reflects how smart you are to be comparing the two. There is no such thing as “stateless” emaratis, those people you are referring too are people who had citizenship of other countries and had been working here for so long that they want to be part of this country and have abolished their passports and official documents to become Emaratis. Perhaps, they are illegal workers too… Everyone who was born on this soil before the UAE and had papers to support it were granted citizenship with the union of the emirates!

“FACT: "Palestinians" have given the UAE ZERO dollars over their missirable fiasco. the UAE has given BILLIONS.”
-- They are in need, and it is normal if the UAE can help would help. Thankfully the UAE is not in war, nor in a crisis where it needs money from anyone. I wonder what do you refer to as ‘missirable fiasco’?? The UAE can supports is self, and I’m sure the UAE doesn’t give and expect anything in return, only in time of need. La teeles etmen 3al awadm…

“FACT: Israel has an actual government, a constitution, and a claim to that land. Before Israel, that land was a part of the british mandate of Palestine, a name the British MADE UP. Before 1912, NO "Palestinians" existed. The people who lived there were Jordanians, Syrians, Egyptians, and constituencies (kind of) of the Ottoman Empire.”
-- Do you read your history resources and double check your sources? There was such thing as Palestinian whether you want to admit it or deny, before even your existence.

“FACT: the "palestinian" issue stems from the fact that their "leaders" are currupt dogs, and they cant get along with each other.”
-- I agree with that!


“FACT: The correct terminology, based on the geographical setting of Gaza would either be Egyptian or Israeli.”
-- There was no Israel back then, why are you trying to attribute Gaza to either side. I wonder what is your IQ level!

Clearly ABIT, you love underestimating people, and stepping on them, and you really think you look smart and sophisticated and reality you don’t. You support your opinion with stuff like I sat with whomever, and I know ever, and my family is of prominence…etc…
Why do you feel you need to bring all this up for you to get you point across…? Perhaps this is your defense mechanism?!

How could you wish for another Muslim, if you’re a Muslim, death? Fully knowing that those Muslim are suffering and being tortured on daily basis at their LANDS AND HOMES! How could you? Regardless of your disagreement with their politics of they way you are you cannot wish them death and go like Oh I have nothing against those people. Don’t even try arguing that this land is a jewish land, those people you call ‘stateless’, are stateless by FORCE, due to the unfortunate circumstance brought upon them! They didn’t come and settle from somewhere these are their lands, I’m sure before you even came to exist in this world!

I quote, “I actually dont have anything PERSONALLY against these people. Nor have I gone through one single situation that makes me "hate" them, The exact opposite... I hate NO ONE... and LIKE NO ONE.”

To wish death for another human being clearly shows that you hate them. When you hope for something like this you’re not and cannot be in the ‘gray stance’ because there is no such option in such situations it is either black or white! Your comments are full of contradiction that I cannot make anything out of you. You claim people here have a pack mentality but you clearly have the packfullest since you acknowledge and believe what the world wants you to believe!

Lirun said...

this explains to you the haj crisis

http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2008/12/03/61285.html

samuraisam said...

Bam. Post locked.

You can all have the same discussion when the same thing happens in 6 months time again. Just like you had the discussion last year, the year before and every single year before that.